star1000

Has anybody gotten any additional information on the supposed conversion offer. From what I have seen so far it seems to be you trade your existing unlimited membership for a 28 day Gold plan and get all the costs and rules of the UE plan. Is there some benefit other than getting back 80% of current value. It seems you give up a lot:
unlimited days to 28
Annual fees go up. Even if you just joined before the merger you will pay $1000 more a year. Forget about those who were locked into lower rates.
Unlimited holidays subject to lottery v. one per year.
Less flexibility on reservations.
Seems that at least you should get the top plan, espcially given that they are throwing perks at new members.

LTTravel

Have they told you how they will handle the holidays? UE has ability to book two years in advance and PE has a lottery. How will they manage that?

vineyarder

Supposedly everyone goes to the lottery in 2010.

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Living in a vacuum sucks!

vineyarder

Agreed; I would have thought that they would have made it more attractive to switch... But I haven't seen anything firm yet...

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Living in a vacuum sucks!

star1000

I also just saw that new UE members are getting a free upgrade. So if you join Gold today you get Platinum for just the extra annual fee. I would hope to see a better deal for those of us who put up money early. Maybe the final deal will look better. Any idea when the package comes out; I thought it was supposed ot have been last week.

DCTraveler

I think they have been so busy handing out as many goodies as they can to prospective/new members during the last year that they have forgotten about original members.

overthetop

Sure seems that Exclusive really plays in the $3mm market and would have more appeal to a potential purchaser interested in that price range.

UE has a hodgepodge of properties in the Elite--some that they got from T&H that are worth over $3mm but also some from the original UR like Steamboat and St Thomas that probably aren't worth $1.5mm. They got next to nothing from PE at the Elite level. The Elite club does not have the consistancy that members seem to get at ER.

They have not addressed this or had any correspndence with their most high end members. Elite members probably feel like all of the attention is going to the other clubs. Would like to hear if UE Elite members see it like I do.

3DH

Welcome, overthetop, if I haven't personally welcomed you before!

The points you bring up are the ones with which I was concerned when we looked into another club to replace our ER membership. When you have a club with various levels of homes or locales it would be difficult to not feel left-in-the-dark if the club was focused on one particular group. I know that the club wouldn't knowlingly disregard one group of membership, but this seems to be a problem/concern that was bound to surface.

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"Boutique" is better! Another extremely satisfied LUSSO member!

LTTravel

welcome overthetop,

Sounds like you are a UR Elite member? Have you brought this up to UE management.

jam

I agree. It feels a bit like the Elite club is the orphaned club. Few new properties, no information about the rate of growth or future hope development, and some of the existing properties in the club probably not in the 3M range.

overthetop

Well, I hope they have their act together. Member communication was not very good during the merger and has not been very good after the merger.

Both UR and PE started as lower level clubs to ER. UR inherited their Elite members when they bought T&H. PE was just getting going on Pinnacle ---only 20 or so members.

I will say UE has better membership plans than ER and very satisfactory locations. The properties seem a bit inconsistant--and with 3 clubs under management and an unfathomable number of individual plan contracts with various incentives etc that were offered over the past 3 years----I think the highest end members in the elite club could use some reassurance from Jim and Richard

star1000

The Premiere club has no necessarily fared much better. While it did get five or six "new" properties, these seem to be Signature properties that were underused or dropped in value. None of them addressed the top need which is year round beach properties. And they really just make up for the fact that there has not been a new property other than watercolor in over a year.

My real issue throughout this has been how with nine months to plan all this nothing seems to have been done in advance and why weeks into the merger we still don't have a clear idea of what is happening on the member facing front. Just as an example, why are there no photos, floor plans, plans for the properties that transferred from UR to Premiere. It doesn't sit well with me that UR had these places for a while and there is no photos of them or anything else PE used to provide.

I'm really getting the sense that the legacy members are going to be the real losers in all this.

Desties

I don't know about that. Since we all seem to agree that the conversion terms being offered are NOT a good deal for legacy members, then it would seem that legacy members are the winners.

As for the new additions, they're not exactly chopped liver. The Sunny Isles property IS beachfront. The Palm Beach and Naples properties are not, but they're pool homes in year-round locations with beaches nearby. Ultimately, it appears to be a move to get the members-to-homes ratio back in line with the 6-to-1 to 7-to-1 ratio. Now that you have TWO companies promoting Premiere -- instead of ONE -- the member growth (and new homes) should improve.

star1000

I don't see a Palm Beach place, where is it listed? I agree Miami is nice, but its a one bedroom and I see it mroe as a City getaway then a family beach place. Naples isn't even listed as a shore property, but as a Golf & Liesure. The two Tahoe properties are nice, but I really wish the new ski places would have been somewhere that a majority of members wouldn't need to change planes to get to. There are few direct flights from the East Coast or even much of the mid-west.

As for terms, I agree that the deal is poor, but not sure it means terms are good. My big concern is how availability is affected by new members having more ARs in the system then our cap. A Gold member can have 21 days in the sytem per year, up to two years ahead. Thus they may get 42 days reserved at a time. Also the new week minimum stays for holidays that are really long weekends will eat up reservation cap days. Other issue is what are we going to be cut out of. It seems we will not be eligible for certain programs such as hotel which seems really unfair. Understand need to cap it, but why can't reciprocity days be used. I just see this as a slippery slope where there are all kinds of things that we are excluded from. Given whole theme of PE was equal access/terms this just bothers me.

Quite frankly if they were offerring Platinum I probably would switch, even with the dues hike (figuring it would even out with 80% of then current redemption) because I think the plan is going to be better.

Desties

There's a good reason why you don't see it listed. It doesn't exist. That's what I get for posting while on the road! I thought that there were two Signature Palm Beach properties and one went to Premiere. It did not. I had it confused with Naples.

As for Trump in Sunny Isles, it may be listed as a metropolitan property, but it's actually closer to Fort Lauderdale's airport than Miami's. It's a very roomy one-bedroom unit. The master suite is huge. The sofa in the living room is a queen sleeper. If you are going in a party of 4-5 people, I recommend the Trump rollaway, which is actually an amazingly sturdy twin bed (not the kind of back-breaking spring-based rollaways most places have). It's also made for water lovers with a pair of heated pools, three jacuzzi spas, and the Sunny Isles beach just an elevator ride away.

star1000

From what I heard about Trump it sounds very nice. Its about time they added Miami to Premiere. On size its perhaps just a general objection I have to the policy of trading "location" for size. 1600 Bway in NY is my poster child. Would much rather have a real 1BR outside of Times Square than a glorified studio on it. That being said I saw the Pinacle apt when there and its fantastic. But if you can't afford a 1BR at the club price point buy elsewhere. So as for Trump as a Premiere property I'll live with size as there are nice trade offs there, but if I had been a Platinum member a 1BR would have annoyed me.

DC Skeptic

80% of current value is a "going concern" issue. The real question you all should have (I am already out) is what the member claim is in bankruptcy. I don't know the details but I think the drift is right: the UE member deposit claim amortizes over time such that at the end of 10 (?) years you have no creditor claim, only an equity claim, i.e. probably nothing. So your real question should be, do I want an equity-like play with the UE plan or keep my 100% of initial deposit creditor claim of a legacy PE.

One of my issues when exiting was the deposit incurred equity risk without enjoying equity return. At least UE seems to be more upfront about this (at least the risk part).

Desties

I guess that's where The Link property comes in. A short walk from Times Square, but with the added luxury or space (1 br for Premiere, 2 br for Signature).