Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process

DC4MS · 03-13-2008, 03:49 PM

What is your idea of a perfect Destination Club reservation process?

Fixed Saturday-Saturday weeks or Flexible dates with check-in on any day
Length of stay for a fixed 7 nights or flexible length of stay from 1-14 nights
Should holiday weeks count 2x as much as an off-season week
Should a Destination Club create a points based system
Lottery vs no lottery for Christmas, New Year, Easter weeks
What should be the limit of advanced reservation 365 or 730 days in advance
Online reservations vs phone representative
Should some locations have a premium cost vs other locations
Should holiday be excluded, rotated, or cost more
Long term vs advanced vs last minute reservation policies

Steamboat Bill · 03-13-2008, 04:31 PM

I think Disney Vacation Club (a timeshare) has what is close to being the perfect or most fair reservation system and could be replicated by a Destination Club.

Disney is a points based system and you buy into the club with a certain amount of points (25-5,000 for example) and you have ultimate flexibility in determining how your points can be used.

DVC also has banking of one year (in the event you don't want to travel) and borrowing from next year (in case you want to double up). Thus, you can get three years of use in one year. This is a great concept, but may not work too well in smaller Destination Clubs.

Disney breaks the point value and the following are factors in their use:
1. Location - certain locations require more points than others
2. Dates - certain dates are more points than others (Friday and Saturday are 2x the points as Monday-Thursday)
3. Room type - you can book a studio, 1 bedroom, 2 bedroom, or 3 bedroom

Applying this point based system to a Destination Club would be awesome as a NYC condo with 3 bedrooms and views of Central park over New Year would require much more points than a 2 bedroom condo at a ski resort during the mud season (May).

Applying a points based system to a destination club would require a study of each individual property to determine the points needed per night for every day of the year. Somehow factors like the cost of the property, cost of maintenance, and demand would need to be accounted for.

On the other hand, a weeks based system like Marriott is much more restrictive (but easier to copy and maintain). You must check in on Friday-Saturday-Sunday and stay for 7 nights. You are only allowed to stay in whatever size unit you buy (unless you downgrade) and there is a premium for certain holiday weeks or prime season.

3DH · 03-13-2008, 04:38 PM

Flexible day check in (we often travel on odd days... must be a personality parallel! )
Flexible number of days, absolutely!
Equal treatment for holidays (I love LUSSO's rotating priority group to keep things fair)
No "points" system... with unlimited use, this is moot point
No lottery for prime holidays -- rather, rotating priority group (Christmas one year, Thanksgiving next, Spring Break following, etc...)
Advanced reservations from 1-2 years out (standard within 1 year)
Definitely ease of online reservations (with phone backup, if necessary)
No premiums on certain locations
Rotating holidays (see above)
I personally like LUSSO's reservation limits -- 4 standard at any time (book another when you return), 2 advanced at a time, short term (booked within 15 days) in addition not counting toward other limits. (Although, I would like to see the short term changed to within 21 days... )

Steamboat Bill · 03-13-2008, 04:44 PM

Here is a real example of Disney Vacation Club in action.

Assume a purchase price of $100 per point. You need to buy enough points to use in one year or you can bank a year's worth of points and even borrow from next year for 2x or 3x points (but you would then have to skip a year or two taking vacations and you would still have to pay annual dues).

Assume annual dues of $4.50 per point. This does go up with CPI each year.

A three bedroom Grand Villa (sleeps 12 people) located at the Animal Kingdom Lodge Villas with a Savanna view during December 24-31 (high season) costs:
120 points per night for Monday-Thursday
145 points for Friday-Saturday
890 points for the week
This would cost $89,000 to buy and $4,005 per year in annual dues.

A three bedroom Grand Villa (sleeps 12 people) located at the Hilton Head Resort during December 1-17 (low season) costs:
24 points per night for Monday-Thursday
48 points for Friday
60 points for Saturday
228 points for the week
This would cost $22,800 to buy and $1,026 per year in annual dues.

A studio (sleeps 4 people) located at the Old Key West Resort (in Orlando) during February 1-15 (mid season) costs:
8 points per night for Monday-Thursday
20 points for Friday-Saturday
80 points for the week
This would cost $8,000 to buy and $360 per year in annual dues.

3DH · 03-13-2008, 04:48 PM

IMHO, trying to recreate a timeshare concept within a DC would truly wreck the system. The fact that the homes would have to be "graded" to attain a value would be difficult at best, as they are all varying sizes in direct correspondence to location and real estate trends.

With all due respect, Bill, let's keep timeshare separate... were we to want that, we would all be timeshare owners and not DC members!

Steamboat Bill · 03-13-2008, 05:30 PM

I am NOT trying to recreate a timeshare system within the Destination Club industry, I mealy used DVC as an example of a "points based reservation system" that I know well. I also think it is the most fair system I have ever used. In addition, DVC has the highest resale and customer satisfaction of any timeshare.

I could have used a Marriott timeshare system or a Personal Residence Club like The Four Seasons in Jackson Hole, but those are week based systems.

I see a variety of different reservation systems with Destination Clubs and none of them are points based. Perhaps there is a reason for that.

Tedpilot · 03-13-2008, 07:10 PM

I don't like point systems at all! Similarly, premium chorged/cost locations and/or times are the same symantics to me. One of the nice things I like is that I don't have to balance cost per night, dates and location to obtimize my vacation dollars, er points. I did that before I joined so now all I have to worry about is "when". I NEVER want to pay a premium in any form for a particular location or time...I just want to enjoy what I've signed up for.

1) I would like better flexibility in check-in dates but I think the system would get gum'd up a bit if that was allowed so I'm not overtly a fan of that. If there were multiple like/type units at a single locale this would work better...for most DCs this does not work.
2) I would like to see lottery systems of some sort with a progressive bias for those that have not obtained their desired date(s). This could be set up for any time, not just holidays. Some of us liek to travel on our birthdays and anniversaries as well.
3) I like to be able to call, email or go online to get my reservations.
4) Advance rservations one year out is plenty of time. If it was nearly 2 years out I'd change my mind by the time I got there and want some other nice/new property.

Steamboat Bill · 03-13-2008, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tedpilot

I don't like point systems at all! Similarly, premium chorged/cost locations and/or times are the same symantics to me. One of the nice things I like is that I don't have to balance cost per night, dates and location to obtimize my vacation dollars, er points. I did that before I joined so now all I have to worry about is "when". I NEVER want to pay a premium in any form for a particular location or time...I just want to enjoy what I've signed up for.

I am not implying that I want any major changes as I have been very happy with the current (and past) HCC reservation system....however, the DC industry is very new and will need to evolve to meet member demands.

I think a "points based system" is a logical choice for any new or struggling DC to consider as an alternative to the current systems. One Key has something similar in they charge a premium for holiday weeks.

I think most of us will agree that there is a huge difference between snagging a Christmas week in Apsen vs a mid-January week in Hilton Head. Under the current system, most DCs threat them the same in terms of cost (i.e. deducting 7 nights from your yearly allotment of nights).

Kagehitokiri · 03-13-2008, 08:58 PM

to me >

#1 ciel
#2 lusso
#3 solstice

hideaways club is a point based DC (season/length) >
The Hideaways Club Destination Points

theres also this fractional club (point based) that includes homes >
Home - Limited Edition

everlands is also interesting, better than YCW for multimember properties IMO.

Tedpilot · 03-14-2008, 08:03 PM

Bill - I hear what you are saying. I think the reality that any DC faces is how to properly balance many of the aspects Doug and you have raised. Any system they start with will likely be their long-term solution or very close to it. It is difficult to drastically change these various reservation systems and associated policies very quickly. The DCs could also face discontent from members if they vary too far from what the members know and expect and paid for when they joined. It's a package deal... # nights, cost, locations, policies, services, etc...

I absolutely agree that not all weeks/locations are of equal worth, however, that is a large lure of the DCs..."I can get XYZ location on such and such dates for...". The key I believe, is to install systems/policies that fairly enable equitable use of high demand locations/times. If we can figure that out here on a macro scale we ought to sell that solution to each of the DCs.

Bourne · 03-15-2008, 04:11 PM

I am not in favor of a Points based system.

In the existing models, the holiday weeks already carry a premium as you have to buy a higer level of membership to get more long term holiday weeks. A high percentage of prime weeks in the right season for the location do not make it to Advance reservation window

IMHO, the clubs should go after the weeks that go un-utilized.

Specific to HCC, I would recommend marking some weeks at specific locations as low season. ( Mud season in Ski areas, Summer in Arizona, etc.).

These weeks can be then be booked within existing rules( e.g. Long term reservation, Advance Reservation etc.) but the days will not be counted against membership plan days. However, you would have to pay $250(current price for extra days) per night for the reservations.

HCC gets more revenue from "nights" that may have a 75%+ chance of going un-utilized. In addition, some of the members may "burn" their Long Term + Long Term Holiday allocations effectively easing the burded on prime holiday weeks.

Just a thought.

Kagehitokiri · 03-15-2008, 04:39 PM

Distinctive Holiday Homes has some properties that cost more or less than 7 nights per week. LTTravel also said they occasionally have promos where they reduce the number of nights required.

Kagehitokiri · 06-23-2008, 10:56 PM

botiga (not yet launched) also uses a points system.

info on lusso from TUG >

Timeshare Users Group Online Community Forums - View Single Post - Lusso Collection article

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3DH

At any given time, a LUSSO member may have 4 "standard" reservations (max 14 days each, but no more than 35 days total at any one time) booked between 15 and 365 days of traveling. Upon commencement of a vacation, another reservation may be made within 365 days. In addition to those 4 reservations, 2 "advanced" reservations may be made (up to 14 days, total) from 366 to 720 days outside of the travel date.

Any travel booked within 15 days of travel is above and beyond the limitations specified above, and does not count to any maximum days.

Each year, you are in a holiday "rotation group", guaranteeing the availability of a property within the specified holiday time period.

Maybe this helps, or maybe this is as clear as mud...!

Timeshare Users Group Online Community Forums - View Single Post - Lusso Collection article

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3DH

While this sounds much more complicated than it is, here is the short of it...

1/3 of the membership is put in each rotation group... with Christmas and New Years split further to make 1/6 of the membership in each of those. With a member:home ration of no more than 5.5:1, assuming (with that ratio) there are 120 members and 22 homes, 40 people would be in the priority release for each holiday rotation (each of more than one week EXCEPT for Christmas and New Years). Those in the Christmas or New Year rotation for that given year would have 20 people (1/6 of the membership) competing for 22 homes... more than enough for one week each.

That isn't to say that you would get your first choice, but you ARE at least guaranteed a reservation of some sort during your priority release.

Now, as far as my experience... I was not in the rotation for New Years this year, but was still able to secure a reservation for that time, AFTER it was released to the general membership. Ditto for spring break... Aspen was still available after the priority release time. So, my experience has shown remarkable availability, even in holiday times!

Kagehitokiri · 06-23-2008, 10:58 PM

info on ciel (no longer accepting members) from TUG >
Timeshare Users Group Online Community Forums - View Single Post - Lusso Collection article

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kagehitokiri

for example here is what i know about ciel >
explorer
- up to 9 reservations(1 week) from 3 months > 12 months out
- 90 day space available window
- 1 26-day reservation(4 reservations combined), rest up to 13 days(2 reservations combined)
- use each property up to 40 days(14 properties X 40 days = 560 days)

executive
- up to 7 reservations(1 week) from 2 months > 12 months out
- 60 day space available window
- reservations up to 13 days(2 reservations combined)
- use each property up to 20 days(14 properties X 20 days = 280 days)

both have 1 "premium" week and 1 gift week

Timeshare Users Group Online Community Forums - View Single Post - DC minimum nights (on sherpa)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kagehitokiri

FYI, max combined reservation lengths for ciel are >
executive = 13-day (2 weeks)
explorer = same + one 26-day (4 weeks)

edit - to clarify >

explorer - up to 10 reservations. 12 months out, 11 months out ... 3 months out.

executive - up to 8 reservations. 12 months out, 8 months out ... 2 months out.

03-13-2008, 04:44 PM	#4
Steamboat Bill Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 332 Club: High Country Club	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process Here is a real example of Disney Vacation Club in action. Assume a purchase price of $100 per point. You need to buy enough points to use in one year or you can bank a year's worth of points and even borrow from next year for 2x or 3x points (but you would then have to skip a year or two taking vacations and you would still have to pay annual dues). Assume annual dues of $4.50 per point. This does go up with CPI each year. A three bedroom Grand Villa (sleeps 12 people) located at the Animal Kingdom Lodge Villas with a Savanna view during December 24-31 (high season) costs: 120 points per night for Monday-Thursday 145 points for Friday-Saturday 890 points for the week This would cost $89,000 to buy and $4,005 per year in annual dues. A three bedroom Grand Villa (sleeps 12 people) located at the Hilton Head Resort during December 1-17 (low season) costs: 24 points per night for Monday-Thursday 48 points for Friday 60 points for Saturday 228 points for the week This would cost $22,800 to buy and $1,026 per year in annual dues. A studio (sleeps 4 people) located at the Old Key West Resort (in Orlando) during February 1-15 (mid season) costs: 8 points per night for Monday-Thursday 20 points for Friday-Saturday 80 points for the week This would cost $8,000 to buy and $360 per year in annual dues.

03-13-2008, 04:48 PM	#5
3DH Super Moderator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 703 Club: LUSSO Collection	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process IMHO, trying to recreate a timeshare concept within a DC would truly wreck the system. The fact that the homes would have to be "graded" to attain a value would be difficult at best, as they are all varying sizes in direct correspondence to location and real estate trends. With all due respect, Bill, let's keep timeshare separate... were we to want that, we would all be timeshare owners and not DC members! __________________ "Boutique" is better! Another extremely satisfied LUSSO member!

03-13-2008, 05:30 PM	#6
Steamboat Bill Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 332 Club: High Country Club	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process I am NOT trying to recreate a timeshare system within the Destination Club industry, I mealy used DVC as an example of a "points based reservation system" that I know well. I also think it is the most fair system I have ever used. In addition, DVC has the highest resale and customer satisfaction of any timeshare. I could have used a Marriott timeshare system or a Personal Residence Club like The Four Seasons in Jackson Hole, but those are week based systems. I see a variety of different reservation systems with Destination Clubs and none of them are points based. Perhaps there is a reason for that.

03-13-2008, 07:10 PM	#7
Tedpilot Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 263 Club: HCC	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process I don't like point systems at all! Similarly, premium chorged/cost locations and/or times are the same symantics to me. One of the nice things I like is that I don't have to balance cost per night, dates and location to obtimize my vacation dollars, er points. I did that before I joined so now all I have to worry about is "when". I NEVER want to pay a premium in any form for a particular location or time...I just want to enjoy what I've signed up for. 1) I would like better flexibility in check-in dates but I think the system would get gum'd up a bit if that was allowed so I'm not overtly a fan of that. If there were multiple like/type units at a single locale this would work better...for most DCs this does not work. 2) I would like to see lottery systems of some sort with a progressive bias for those that have not obtained their desired date(s). This could be set up for any time, not just holidays. Some of us liek to travel on our birthdays and anniversaries as well. 3) I like to be able to call, email or go online to get my reservations. 4) Advance rservations one year out is plenty of time. If it was nearly 2 years out I'd change my mind by the time I got there and want some other nice/new property.

03-13-2008, 08:58 PM	#9
Kagehitokiri Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,389	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process to me > #1 ciel #2 lusso #3 solstice hideaways club is a point based DC (season/length) > The Hideaways Club Destination Points theres also this fractional club (point based) that includes homes > Home - Limited Edition everlands is also interesting, better than YCW for multimember properties IMO. Last edited by Kagehitokiri; 04-01-2008 at 09:06 PM.

03-13-2008, 03:49 PM	#1
DC4MS Administrator Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: USA Posts: 1,484 Club: DC4MS.com	Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process What is your idea of a perfect Destination Club reservation process? Fixed Saturday-Saturday weeks or Flexible dates with check-in on any day Length of stay for a fixed 7 nights or flexible length of stay from 1-14 nights Should holiday weeks count 2x as much as an off-season week Should a Destination Club create a points based system Lottery vs no lottery for Christmas, New Year, Easter weeks What should be the limit of advanced reservation 365 or 730 days in advance Online reservations vs phone representative Should some locations have a premium cost vs other locations Should holiday be excluded, rotated, or cost more Long term vs advanced vs last minute reservation policies

03-13-2008, 04:31 PM	#2
Steamboat Bill Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 332 Club: High Country Club	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process I think Disney Vacation Club (a timeshare) has what is close to being the perfect or most fair reservation system and could be replicated by a Destination Club. Disney is a points based system and you buy into the club with a certain amount of points (25-5,000 for example) and you have ultimate flexibility in determining how your points can be used. DVC also has banking of one year (in the event you don't want to travel) and borrowing from next year (in case you want to double up). Thus, you can get three years of use in one year. This is a great concept, but may not work too well in smaller Destination Clubs. Disney breaks the point value and the following are factors in their use: 1. Location - certain locations require more points than others 2. Dates - certain dates are more points than others (Friday and Saturday are 2x the points as Monday-Thursday) 3. Room type - you can book a studio, 1 bedroom, 2 bedroom, or 3 bedroom Applying this point based system to a Destination Club would be awesome as a NYC condo with 3 bedrooms and views of Central park over New Year would require much more points than a 2 bedroom condo at a ski resort during the mud season (May). Applying a points based system to a destination club would require a study of each individual property to determine the points needed per night for every day of the year. Somehow factors like the cost of the property, cost of maintenance, and demand would need to be accounted for. On the other hand, a weeks based system like Marriott is much more restrictive (but easier to copy and maintain). You must check in on Friday-Saturday-Sunday and stay for 7 nights. You are only allowed to stay in whatever size unit you buy (unless you downgrade) and there is a premium for certain holiday weeks or prime season.

03-13-2008, 04:38 PM	#3
3DH Super Moderator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 703 Club: LUSSO Collection	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process Flexible day check in (we often travel on odd days... must be a personality parallel! ) Flexible number of days, absolutely! Equal treatment for holidays (I love LUSSO's rotating priority group to keep things fair) No "points" system... with unlimited use, this is moot point No lottery for prime holidays -- rather, rotating priority group (Christmas one year, Thanksgiving next, Spring Break following, etc...) Advanced reservations from 1-2 years out (standard within 1 year) Definitely ease of online reservations (with phone backup, if necessary) No premiums on certain locations Rotating holidays (see above) I personally like LUSSO's reservation limits -- 4 standard at any time (book another when you return), 2 advanced at a time, short term (booked within 15 days) in addition not counting toward other limits. *(Although, I would like to see the short term changed to within 21 days... )* __________________ "Boutique" is better! Another extremely satisfied LUSSO member!

03-14-2008, 08:03 PM	#10
Tedpilot Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 263 Club: HCC	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process Bill - I hear what you are saying. I think the reality that any DC faces is how to properly balance many of the aspects Doug and you have raised. Any system they start with will likely be their long-term solution or very close to it. It is difficult to drastically change these various reservation systems and associated policies very quickly. The DCs could also face discontent from members if they vary too far from what the members know and expect and paid for when they joined. It's a package deal... # nights, cost, locations, policies, services, etc... I absolutely agree that not all weeks/locations are of equal worth, however, that is a large lure of the DCs..."I can get XYZ location on such and such dates for...". The key I believe, is to install systems/policies that fairly enable equitable use of high demand locations/times. If we can figure that out here on a macro scale we ought to sell that solution to each of the DCs.

03-15-2008, 04:11 PM	#11
Bourne Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: 60601 Posts: 309 Club: High Country Club, Pinnacle Yachts	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process I am not in favor of a Points based system. In the existing models, the holiday weeks already carry a premium as you have to buy a higer level of membership to get more long term holiday weeks. A high percentage of prime weeks in the right season for the location do not make it to Advance reservation window IMHO, the clubs should go after the weeks that go un-utilized. Specific to HCC, I would recommend marking some weeks at specific locations as low season. ( Mud season in Ski areas, Summer in Arizona, etc.). These weeks can be then be booked within existing rules( e.g. Long term reservation, Advance Reservation etc.) but the days will not be counted against membership plan days. However, you would have to pay $250(current price for extra days) per night for the reservations. HCC gets more revenue from "nights" that may have a 75%+ chance of going un-utilized. In addition, some of the members may "burn" their Long Term + Long Term Holiday allocations effectively easing the burded on prime holiday weeks. Just a thought.

03-15-2008, 04:39 PM	#12
Kagehitokiri Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,389	Re: Creating the perfect Destination Club reservation process Distinctive Holiday Homes has some properties that cost more or less than 7 nights per week. LTTravel also said they occasionally have promos where they reduce the number of nights required. Last edited by Kagehitokiri; 04-02-2008 at 12:15 AM.